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	<title>Comments for What's This Mormon Thing?</title>
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	<description>Hostile Anti-Mormon posts subject to editing or deletion</description>
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		<title>Comment on Why Do Mormons Leave The Church? by sandrar</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/why-do-mormons-leave-the-church/#comment-476</link>
		<dc:creator>sandrar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Sep 2009 19:52:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=185#comment-476</guid>
		<description>Hi! I was surfing and found your blog post... nice! I love your blog.  :) Cheers! Sandra. R.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi! I was surfing and found your blog post&#8230; nice! I love your blog.  <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  Cheers! Sandra. R.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by jackg</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-474</link>
		<dc:creator>jackg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Aug 2009 15:42:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-474</guid>
		<description>BTW...I don&#039;t have $1.50.  Sorry...:-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BTW&#8230;I don&#8217;t have $1.50.  Sorry&#8230;:-)</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by jackg</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-473</link>
		<dc:creator>jackg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Aug 2009 15:41:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-473</guid>
		<description>JLF,

I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, and he commented that I interpreted the OT as a Christian rather than as a Jew.  What do you think about such a comment?  Is it valid?  After all, I would have to say that I am a Christian and not a Jew.  

Also,  regarding your comment to my first post, I would have to say that God is illuminating for me the fallacies in the BOM regarding theology.  I think I might have told you, but there were two significant occasions within the last few years when I wanted the Church to be true.  Those occurred when my son left for and returned from his mission.  So, I reread it then with the purpose of finding it to be true.  I can understand where you&#039;re coming from when you question my motive for reading the BOM.  Currently, I am reading it to engage better with LDS.  I am finding that even the sections I thought were beautiful literature have a lot of theology that does not agree with the biblical text.  I can&#039;t remember what section of D&amp;C I was reading last night...perhaps 133 or something.  It was after JS death and was written by one of the witnesses to his death (can&#039;t remember his name right now).  Anyway, as I was reading it, I was thinking how well-written it was.  It was a plea to the members of the Church to take heart and continue forward even though their leader was slain.  Then, I got to the verse where he said that salvation was based on faith in Christ AND adherence to the ordinances of the gospel.  As you know, I take that as a Christ PLUS something else, which I believe is contrary to the biblical text.  I know we have been on the faith and works merry-go-round discussion, and don&#039;t intend on rehashing it.  I believe, Jack, that the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob has empowered me with the Holy Spirit as a believer in Christ, and that the Holy Spirit is illuminating for me the truth of God&#039;s revealed Word, which has led me to conclude that the LDS Church is not Christ&#039;s church.

We&#039;ve been through a lot, and I can understand the considerations you posted.  It&#039;s fair for you to express that.  The one thing you have taught me and that I have failed at--and quite miserably at times--is being respectful during such discussions.  I generally tend to attack the person, and that is not what God wants me to do.  I walk in the flesh when I do that, and I don&#039;t want to do that, anymore.  You have accused me of being a person who wanted to destroy another person by attacking their beliefs and faith system.  As much as I didn&#039;t like that accusation, I had to confess to God that you were right.  I was a hypocrite, speaking motives of love but demonstrating a disregard for people.  I know, even I as I make this confession, I am minimizing my behavior.  You were right in a lot of things about me, Jack, and I have considered your words because I do respect you--even if I don&#039;t agree with you.  And, I think that is the goal of your ministry with this blog.  So, you have been successful with me.  I am still growing, however, so please forgive me if I slip every now and then.  I know you&#039;ll point it out if I do.  :-)

  
Jack,  I was wondering if you could email me.  I have a personal matter to discuss with you concerning my return missionary son, and I would like to know the Church&#039;s current standing on a current social issue.  Thanks.

Peace and Grace!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JLF,</p>
<p>I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, and he commented that I interpreted the OT as a Christian rather than as a Jew.  What do you think about such a comment?  Is it valid?  After all, I would have to say that I am a Christian and not a Jew.  </p>
<p>Also,  regarding your comment to my first post, I would have to say that God is illuminating for me the fallacies in the BOM regarding theology.  I think I might have told you, but there were two significant occasions within the last few years when I wanted the Church to be true.  Those occurred when my son left for and returned from his mission.  So, I reread it then with the purpose of finding it to be true.  I can understand where you&#8217;re coming from when you question my motive for reading the BOM.  Currently, I am reading it to engage better with LDS.  I am finding that even the sections I thought were beautiful literature have a lot of theology that does not agree with the biblical text.  I can&#8217;t remember what section of D&amp;C I was reading last night&#8230;perhaps 133 or something.  It was after JS death and was written by one of the witnesses to his death (can&#8217;t remember his name right now).  Anyway, as I was reading it, I was thinking how well-written it was.  It was a plea to the members of the Church to take heart and continue forward even though their leader was slain.  Then, I got to the verse where he said that salvation was based on faith in Christ AND adherence to the ordinances of the gospel.  As you know, I take that as a Christ PLUS something else, which I believe is contrary to the biblical text.  I know we have been on the faith and works merry-go-round discussion, and don&#8217;t intend on rehashing it.  I believe, Jack, that the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob has empowered me with the Holy Spirit as a believer in Christ, and that the Holy Spirit is illuminating for me the truth of God&#8217;s revealed Word, which has led me to conclude that the LDS Church is not Christ&#8217;s church.</p>
<p>We&#8217;ve been through a lot, and I can understand the considerations you posted.  It&#8217;s fair for you to express that.  The one thing you have taught me and that I have failed at&#8211;and quite miserably at times&#8211;is being respectful during such discussions.  I generally tend to attack the person, and that is not what God wants me to do.  I walk in the flesh when I do that, and I don&#8217;t want to do that, anymore.  You have accused me of being a person who wanted to destroy another person by attacking their beliefs and faith system.  As much as I didn&#8217;t like that accusation, I had to confess to God that you were right.  I was a hypocrite, speaking motives of love but demonstrating a disregard for people.  I know, even I as I make this confession, I am minimizing my behavior.  You were right in a lot of things about me, Jack, and I have considered your words because I do respect you&#8211;even if I don&#8217;t agree with you.  And, I think that is the goal of your ministry with this blog.  So, you have been successful with me.  I am still growing, however, so please forgive me if I slip every now and then.  I know you&#8217;ll point it out if I do.  <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Jack,  I was wondering if you could email me.  I have a personal matter to discuss with you concerning my return missionary son, and I would like to know the Church&#8217;s current standing on a current social issue.  Thanks.</p>
<p>Peace and Grace!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by JLFuller</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-472</link>
		<dc:creator>JLFuller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Aug 2009 02:34:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-472</guid>
		<description>I will take a minute here to answer your first post. As I see it Jack, you may just be reading the B of M looking to find fault. That is a pretty common thing to do for many non LDS. I have no way of knowing for certain, but I suspect that is the case based on our many previous exchanges and the way most anti-Mormons think. That is, &quot;this book is not of God therefore I will read it to find more heresies and inconsistencies I can use to tear the Mormon thinking a part&quot;.  But that can&#039;t work for the honest in heart. The genuine seeker of truth will not have his mind made up and will be open to the promptings of the Holy Ghost. In your case, and the case with all other former Mormons, you broke your covenant and there is a penalty to pay. The penalty is the withdrawal of the Holy Ghost. That is God&#039;s punishment. You may very well experience something akin to a prompting but I think it could either be a self generated feeling or it could also be Satan just laying off you because he knows he has you so why waste the time and energy. Personally, I think it is the latter.  

CONSIDERATIONS:

A. If you bristle at the thought of the latter then I would take that as a sign of how right I am.
B. You might be prompted to set me straight with a blistering retort. 
C. You might want to put a soft face on a response and correct me with &quot;Christ-like&quot; soft words. 
D. You may struggle trying to find a way to to respond in a way to prove how wrong I am and how right you are. 
E. The inner anxt you feel to respond will be almost over-powering. 

In the end, what ever you say or don&#039;t say, only you will really know. I can only guess. Actually, it won&#039;t make a bit of difference because I probably won&#039;t believe you anyway, if that even matters. Ultimately, I don&#039;t think you can know the Holy Ghost until you make it right with your bishop and come back into the Church. That is my take on it. That will $1.50 please. Kindly pay the nice lady on your way out. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I will take a minute here to answer your first post. As I see it Jack, you may just be reading the B of M looking to find fault. That is a pretty common thing to do for many non LDS. I have no way of knowing for certain, but I suspect that is the case based on our many previous exchanges and the way most anti-Mormons think. That is, &#8220;this book is not of God therefore I will read it to find more heresies and inconsistencies I can use to tear the Mormon thinking a part&#8221;.  But that can&#8217;t work for the honest in heart. The genuine seeker of truth will not have his mind made up and will be open to the promptings of the Holy Ghost. In your case, and the case with all other former Mormons, you broke your covenant and there is a penalty to pay. The penalty is the withdrawal of the Holy Ghost. That is God&#8217;s punishment. You may very well experience something akin to a prompting but I think it could either be a self generated feeling or it could also be Satan just laying off you because he knows he has you so why waste the time and energy. Personally, I think it is the latter.  </p>
<p>CONSIDERATIONS:</p>
<p>A. If you bristle at the thought of the latter then I would take that as a sign of how right I am.<br />
B. You might be prompted to set me straight with a blistering retort.<br />
C. You might want to put a soft face on a response and correct me with &#8220;Christ-like&#8221; soft words.<br />
D. You may struggle trying to find a way to to respond in a way to prove how wrong I am and how right you are.<br />
E. The inner anxt you feel to respond will be almost over-powering. </p>
<p>In the end, what ever you say or don&#8217;t say, only you will really know. I can only guess. Actually, it won&#8217;t make a bit of difference because I probably won&#8217;t believe you anyway, if that even matters. Ultimately, I don&#8217;t think you can know the Holy Ghost until you make it right with your bishop and come back into the Church. That is my take on it. That will $1.50 please. Kindly pay the nice lady on your way out.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by JLFuller</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-471</link>
		<dc:creator>JLFuller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Aug 2009 02:11:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-471</guid>
		<description>Sure. He is a professor of ancient scripture at BYU. I dare say much of the misunderstanding of the B of M comes from modern people reading the book using modern understanding. The first books of the B of M were written by prophets using terms commonly used during their time. Draper also brings a more complete view of modern scripture juxtaposed against ancient scripture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure. He is a professor of ancient scripture at BYU. I dare say much of the misunderstanding of the B of M comes from modern people reading the book using modern understanding. The first books of the B of M were written by prophets using terms commonly used during their time. Draper also brings a more complete view of modern scripture juxtaposed against ancient scripture.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by jackg</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-470</link>
		<dc:creator>jackg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Aug 2009 22:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-470</guid>
		<description>Could you first tell me who Richard Draper is?

BTW, I thought you had started writing again, but just now realized the date is 2008.

Blessings...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could you first tell me who Richard Draper is?</p>
<p>BTW, I thought you had started writing again, but just now realized the date is 2008.</p>
<p>Blessings&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by JLFuller</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-469</link>
		<dc:creator>JLFuller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Aug 2009 19:57:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-469</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know about that Jack. Why don&#039;t you send an e-mail to Richard Draper at http://religion.byu.edu/send_mail.php?f=Richard%20D.&amp;l=Draper and ask him? I would be intersted to know what he says.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know about that Jack. Why don&#8217;t you send an e-mail to Richard Draper at <a href="http://religion.byu.edu/send_mail.php?f=Richard%20D.&amp;l=Draper" rel="nofollow">http://religion.byu.edu/send_mail.php?f=Richard%20D.&amp;l=Draper</a> and ask him? I would be intersted to know what he says.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Give The Lord Equal Time by jackg</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/give-the-lord-equal-time/#comment-468</link>
		<dc:creator>jackg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Aug 2009 00:11:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=225#comment-468</guid>
		<description>JLF,

I have been rereading the BOM.  I think it&#039;s odd that Nephi, who is supposedly from the lineage of Joseph refers to the Jews as &quot;the Jews&quot; in a way that makes it sound like he&#039;s not a part of them.  Do you not find that odd?  Also, it seems that the emphasis in the book of 1st Nephi is focused solely on obedience but not relationship.  What do you believe being in a relationship with Jesus Christ looks like?

Also, I have been reading some D&amp;C.  At the end of section 132, Jesus is the one supposedly speaking and he makes a reference to the Law of Sarah.  It also sounds as if Abram did exactly what the LORD wanted him to do when he took Hagar as a wife and had Ishmael with her.  I do not get this impression from reading the Genesis account; in fact, Abram acted on his own based on his judgment of his circumstances and was not patient in waiting on the LORD to fulfill His promises.  Do you think the end of 132 makes sense?  If so, why?

Reading the BOM and the other standard works of the Church have not led me back to Mormonism or restored my testimony; in fact, it is proving that my testimony regarding the authority of the Bible is the testimony God has instilled in me through the power of the Holy Spirit.  I pray that all Mormons will come to know the True and Living God as revealed in the biblical text, which is the inspired Word of God.

Peace and Grace!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JLF,</p>
<p>I have been rereading the BOM.  I think it&#8217;s odd that Nephi, who is supposedly from the lineage of Joseph refers to the Jews as &#8220;the Jews&#8221; in a way that makes it sound like he&#8217;s not a part of them.  Do you not find that odd?  Also, it seems that the emphasis in the book of 1st Nephi is focused solely on obedience but not relationship.  What do you believe being in a relationship with Jesus Christ looks like?</p>
<p>Also, I have been reading some D&amp;C.  At the end of section 132, Jesus is the one supposedly speaking and he makes a reference to the Law of Sarah.  It also sounds as if Abram did exactly what the LORD wanted him to do when he took Hagar as a wife and had Ishmael with her.  I do not get this impression from reading the Genesis account; in fact, Abram acted on his own based on his judgment of his circumstances and was not patient in waiting on the LORD to fulfill His promises.  Do you think the end of 132 makes sense?  If so, why?</p>
<p>Reading the BOM and the other standard works of the Church have not led me back to Mormonism or restored my testimony; in fact, it is proving that my testimony regarding the authority of the Bible is the testimony God has instilled in me through the power of the Holy Spirit.  I pray that all Mormons will come to know the True and Living God as revealed in the biblical text, which is the inspired Word of God.</p>
<p>Peace and Grace!</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Journal of Discourses &#8211; Not an Authorized Source of Mormon Doctrine by jackg</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2009/01/12/not-an-authorized-source-of-mormon-doctrinthe-journal-of-discourses-is-it-an-authorized-source-for-mormon-doctrine/#comment-467</link>
		<dc:creator>jackg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 03:46:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=539#comment-467</guid>
		<description>JLF,

It&#039;s dead end for you because then you just might have to take a look at your testimony in light of biblical scripture.  Are you saying there aren&#039;t false spirits?  I think it&#039;s curious that  you pass on this.  You might want to examine your motives.  As always, I am praying for your release from the bondage of Mormonism.

Peace and Grace!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JLF,</p>
<p>It&#8217;s dead end for you because then you just might have to take a look at your testimony in light of biblical scripture.  Are you saying there aren&#8217;t false spirits?  I think it&#8217;s curious that  you pass on this.  You might want to examine your motives.  As always, I am praying for your release from the bondage of Mormonism.</p>
<p>Peace and Grace!</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Journal of Discourses &#8211; Not an Authorized Source of Mormon Doctrine by JLFuller</title>
		<link>http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/2009/01/12/not-an-authorized-source-of-mormon-doctrinthe-journal-of-discourses-is-it-an-authorized-source-for-mormon-doctrine/#comment-466</link>
		<dc:creator>JLFuller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 13:43:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mormonthing.wordpress.com/?p=539#comment-466</guid>
		<description>Jack
False spirits? Jack this is a dead end subject. I think I will pass.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jack<br />
False spirits? Jack this is a dead end subject. I think I will pass.</p>
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